John Piper on Hal Lindsey & End-Times Speculation

Well, if I haven’t thoroughly outed myself as a “Piperite”, two posts in one day featuring my favorite pastor should do the trick.

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I read Piper’s 1974 essay on Hal Lindsey’s The Late, Great Planet Earth this morning, and could not pass on the opportunity to forward it along.

Since reading Tim LaHaye and Jerry B. Jenkins’ Left Behind and witnessing the ensuing marketing phenomenon more than a decade ago, I have been uncomfortable with the assurance, and often the stridency, with which some adhere to the Premillennial/Dispensational eschatological system.

I occasionally listen to a weekend radio program on the local Christian AM station that deals exclusively with this topic. While I do not doubt the sincerity of the host’s faith, I am often disturbed at the passion attached to such a tangential issue (the precise outworking of Biblical prophecy in current events). I am more disturbed by the passion with which this host often criticizes her brothers and sisters in Christ who don’t subscribe to this particular eschatological system (a system that has no history in the Church predating the 19th Century).

Piper writes:

This is the most important: among those who calculate about the time and sequence of the coming events and who try to give detailed descriptions of how it will be, there is, I think, a fundamentally wrong focus, a dislocation of our “blessed hope.” Throughout the New Testament the all-important focus of our hope is personal fellowship with God and our Lord Jesus Christ…

… But for the calculator of the end times this all-important personal focus of our hope gets blurred in a mass of secondary (often speculative) details.

Amen! This is my chief concern with so many Christian ministries wandering into various aberrant teachings. Dispensational end-times speculation, fixations on mystical experience and supernatural charismata, the Prosperity Gospel, the Megachurch self-improvement progams, and a myriad of other modern errors all have this in common: They are all a giant distraction from the main thing - Jesus Christ and His Gospel.

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Flirting With Amillennialism

Sam Storms, the charismatic Calvinist, recently defined himself theologically. While I disagree with Storms’ charismatic views of prophecy and continued Apostolic ministry, I have read quite a bit of the material he has made available on his site and have learned a great deal from this ministry.

Storms is an Amillennialist. I have read several of his articles on eschatology and have found them very reasonable, persuasive and biblical. Storms briefly sketches his Amillennialism:

I am an Amillennialist. This is a huge topic on which I am currently writing a book. So I’ll limit myself here to only a few specifics.

a. One of the primary reasons I am not a Premillennialist (neither Historic nor Dispensational) is because of what I read in the NT concerning the Second Coming of Christ.

To be a Premillennialist of any sort, you must believe that physical death and the curse on the natural creation will continue to exist beyond the time of Christ’s return. You must believe that the New Heavens and New Earth will not be introduced until 1,000 years subsequent to the return of Christ. You must believe that unbelieving men and women will still have the opportunity to come to saving faith in Christ for at least 1,000 years subsequent to his return. To be a Premillennialist, you must believe that unbelievers will not be finally resurrected until at least 1,000 years subsequent to Christ’s return and that unbelievers will not be finally judged and cast into eternal punishment until at least 1,000 years subsequent to Christ’s return.

But my reading of what happens at the Second Coming of Christ indicates that then, and not 1,000 years later, physical death is swallowed up in the victory of Christ, never again to exert its power; the natural creation is delivered fully and finally from its bondage to sin; the New Heavens and New Earth are inaugurated; all opportunity for salvation of the lost comes to an end; and both the final resurrection and final judgment of all mankind occur.

b. I find no biblical support for a pre-tribulation rapture, Christian Zionism, a distinction between Israel and the Church, or a future seven year period known as the Great Tribulation.

c. I believe Matthew 24:1-35; Mark 13:1-31; and Luke 21:5-33 (otherwise known as the Olivet Discourse) refer to events that transpired in the first century, beginning with the exaltation of Christ and consummating with the destruction in 70 a.d. of both the city of Jerusalem and its Temple.

As I said, I hope to finish a book on eschatology sometime in 2008, but in the meantime you may read several articles in defense of these beliefs, available on my website under Theological Studies, Eschatology.

To be honest, I find all of these arguments quite convincing. I was raised as a default Dispensational Premillennialist, believing in a literal 7-year Great Tribulation preceded by the rapture of God’s saints. I have since (before encountering Storms or Amillennialism) been convinced that scripture nowhere describes the world-shattering event of a pre-tribulational rapture. I just cannot find two Second Comings in scripture.

I also struggle with the idea of the world continuing on in sin and death after Christ’s return. I can’t even wrap my mind around how that would work. And what about the final unleashing of Satan after this literal 1,000 year period? Does Christ defeat Satan/Antichrist twice? I don’t know. It all just seems very confusing.

I have also become disabused of the notion that the Church and Israel are two distinct entities in the economy of God. The more I read scripture (particularly the Pauline epistles), the more I see the Church being grafted onto the tree that is Israel - one tree. God has one people. He has always had one people. I am a child of Abraham. My unbelieving Jewish neighbors are not. I think this insistence on distinguishing Israel and the Church drives much Premillennial thought (particularly the Dispensational variety).

(I know I run the risk of being labeled as an adherent of “Replacement Theology” with the above paragraph, but… well, that’s just how I see it right now. I’m willing to be persuaded otherwise.)

I don’t yet call myself an Amillennialist. Because I am thoroughly convinced that Christ will be returning for His Bride only once, I waffle between Historic Premillennialism (post-tribulational) and Amillennialism. I know Amillennialism is loathed by many Christians, so here’s your chance! Convince me Storms is wrong and rescue me from this eschatological heresy!

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A Response to Zack H. on IHOP and Intercession

On 12/28/2007, I posited a question to Zack H. at Forever Nocturnal.

Zack has been gracious enough to devote a post to his response. I will likewise post my response here and over at Zack’s.

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Zack,

Thanks for taking the time to answer my question. You make me think these things through a bit more thoroughly as well.

First, I should address the issue of God’s sovereignty and prayer/intercession. You said:

God is all sovereign. …He doesn’t need us. Yet that’s the glory of the gospel, He desires that we partner with him, to be with him.

I believe I have stated this before, but likely not as clearly and emphatically as I should have:

I am a Calvinist. I believe in God’s absolute sovereignty over all, including the wills of men. I believe nothing happens apart from God’s predetermined plan. I believe no one hinders or turns back God (Job) through unbelief, lack of prayer or by any other means.

I also believe God has sovereignly ordained to realize much of His will via the prayers of His people. I believe prayer moves God, though I would say it moves Him to a place He had already determined to go. That He folds us into His sovereignty in this way truly is glorious.

I don’t think you and I are very far apart here. I nowhere meant to give the impression that I do not believe God is moved by prayer.

(John Piper preached on prayer two Sundays ago. You and I would find much to agree on here.)

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On to my persisting issues:

The purpose of IHOP is not to make Jesus come back faster. Our purpose is to fast and pray because we believe Jesus is coming back soon. (Again I speak for IHOP in that as well because it’s a public fact, but I am not an official spokesman nor can I be labeled as one.)

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Do I or have I heard it preached at IHOP that we are praying for the purpose of bringing Jesus back faster? No. But IHOP and I do believe Jesus is coming back soon.

I’m not sure this is a distinction with any difference. Perhaps, I again need to be a bit clearer. I recognize IHOP intercessors are not praying “to make Jesus come back faster”, but believe He is coming back soon (faster?) and this return is contingent upon prayer (contingent in the manner I would defend above). And not just any prayer - 24/7, Bridally Paradigm-ed prayer. You said:

Our prayers fill the bowl not because He needs us, but because He wants us. (John 3:16; John17) Thus why the Bridal Paradigm is needed.

24/7 prayer and the Bridal Paradigm are necessary to propel the end-times saints into the kind of prayer and holiness that will be required to usher in Christ’s Second Coming. This is exactly what Jennifer Roberts spoke of when I saw her at onething Minneapolis. (See: Here and here for my comments on Roberts, onething and the Bridal Paradigm.) I will concede that it is probably not your, Roberts’ or IHOP’s intent to portray 24/7 prayer or the Bridal Paradigm as a means of manipulating God. However, when these are lifted up as necessary, it inevitably gives the impression that if these are not followed (at least by a small vanguard of full-time intercessors), then Christ will not return.

Creating a place on the Earth for the spirit of the Lord to dwell. Not saying that we need to reestablish the rabbinic tabernacle of David. But saying we need to create a place with in us for the Holy Spirit to rest. Christ is in us. The Spirit already abides in us, but by resting place I mean a place free of gossip and slander. A place free of lust and perversion. A place where the spirit can rest. The city of refuge is not a biblical quotation, but from a prophecy about cities of refuge being raised up at the end of the Age.

To which prophecy do you refer? This drives to the heart of my problem with IHOP and other modern charismatic/prophetic ministries: they are driven, at least in part, by a gnostic understanding of Christianity and the Bible. No one outside this clique has any knowledge of the Bridal Paradigm, Cities of Refuge, the Joseph Company, Joel’s Army, Tabernacle of David… because they are essentially extra-biblical. They are wrapped in biblical language, but are really founded on extra-biblical, personal, divine revelation. If God hadn’t “spoken” to Mike Bickle, Bob Jones, Paul Cain, etc., then none of the above concepts/paradigms would exist.

To get into this clique, one must have a similar special, divine, personal, extra-biblical revelation about these things. As you and Roberts have both stated, these things are essential to what “God is doing” in these “final days”. I believe you have stated elsewhere on your blog that you believe we are fast-approaching the eschaton, because God told you so.

But what about the rest of us - the 99.9% of believers who haven’t received these secret messages from God? When people accuse IHOP’rs and other prophetic/charismatic types of being elitist, I don’t think they necessarily mean it personally or individually, but corporately. The movement is definitionally elitist, because it hinges on personal, extra-biblical revelation from God. It is, in this sense, a gnostic elitism.

“…we need to create a place with in us for the Holy Spirit to rest.”

I honestly don’t know what that means. If I (or my family, local church, small group, etc.) need to be free of gossip, slander, lust and perversion in order for the “Holy Spirit to rest”, I am/we are in trouble. This smacks of a moral perfectionism I see in much modern charismatic/prophetic language. No one individual or community is or ever will be free of sin this side of eternity. We Christians, sinners all, are sealed with the promised Holy Spirit as a guarantee of our inheritance (Eph. 1), not because we cleaned house beforehand, but because God is gracious, merciful and good to His undeserving called-out ones.

Do you believe IHOP is a place free of gossip, slander, lust and perversion? I don’t believe you do, and don’t believe your point here was to say that you do. But, why say it at all then? What’s the point? I think this again drives to the perceived elitism - there seems to be the implication that the average Bible-believing Christian church/ministry does not strive for holiness in the same way IHOP does, because it is not devoted to 24/7 prayer and the Bridal Paradigm (and Joel’s Army, and the JoCo, and establishing Cities of Refuge, etc.). I know that’s not your intent, Zack, but I think it is an understandable perception taken by those on the outside. (I also understand IHOP leadership repeatedly states their mission is not for the whole Church, but a small troupe of intercessors. However, I think this only reinforces the perception of elitism. IHOP is not for everyone, but only a select few. It’s like the Navy Seals of Christian spirituality.)

Zack, please accept that I say all of the above out of a genuine concern and desire to understand more clearly, not a desire to be unnecessarily quarrelsome. I don’t doubt the genuineness of your faith, and I admire your zeal. I just believe it is a zeal that could be put to better use.

God Bless,

Jim B.

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P.S. If you happen to read/listen to/watch Piper’s sermon on prayer, I believe he paints a much more biblical picture of 24/7 prayer. It is not the picture of an Intercessory Missionary, but of a common saint breathing prayer as a 24/7 lifestyle. Though I fall dreadfully short of this goal, it is my life’s aim in regard to prayer.

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More Thoughts on onething and the Bridal Paradigm

(My initial thoughts on onething and the Bridal Paradigm)

Bridal Paradigm, Dominionism and the Imminence of Eschaton

“…it’s a crazy season of life right now to raise children and it’s appropriate that our 10 year olds raise the dead… I’m not joking… it’s appropriate our 10 year olds start prophesying and lay bare the hearts of men… it’s time for that, we’re in that hour of human history… start seeing our children as co-heirs with Christ.”

“The Church that is convinced of His affection is unstoppable… because she has authority… she starts raising the dead because she’s been close to His heart… I know that you [Christ] don’t like cancer, and I’m going to take authority over cancer in the name of Jesus, because I know my husband and I know He went to the cross for it and I know He doesn’t want it and I know that He has given me authority and I bear His name and He shares it with me and as the Bride and Bridegroom have partnership, so do you with God!”

“…because, friends, we’ve got the dead to raise. We can’t live down here with low-level issues [sin struggles]. The blind need to see. Cancer needs to leave from whole cities. We need to start walking in true authority.”

- Jennifer Roberts, onething 2007 Minneapolis

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I have always been unsettled by the conviction within the modern prophetic movement (IHOP, MorningStar, ElijahList, etc.) that we are on the brink of apocalypse. However, I have been urged by some within this movement that I misunderstand this conviction (especially in regard to IHOP/Bickle). I have been told that while some within the movement do believe the four horsemen are breathing down our necks, this is not an absolute conviction, and many within the movement do not necessarily believe this.

Mrs. Roberts’ opening message at onething 2007 Minneapolis belies the above sentiment. The steady suggestions of heretofore unseen miraculous powers being wielded by ten-year-olds, cancer-free cities of refuge, etc. betray the reality that IHOP leadership does believe we are fast approaching the beginning of the end.

“We’re in that hour of human history…” What else can this refer to, but Roberts’ belief that the Church is entering the end of the age - a period in which the Church will wield unprecedented supernatural power (dominion…?)? The modern prophets and apostles have been saying for quite some time that the end times generation of Christians (or at least those in the vanguard of this movement - those climbing Rick Joyner’s mountain) will outperform the Apostles (the real ones) and Old Testament prophets.

This kind of supernatural hype seems to permeate much of the onething message to its young audience. “The end is nigh, and God is doing a nu thang! You too can raise the dead and abolish cancer from entire cities! Don’t miss out! Join now!”

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