DefendingContending, Mark Driscoll & Apollinarianism

2008 November 25
by Jim B.

On September 30, 2008 Desert Pastor of Team DefCon posted Mark Driscoll Mocks the Sinlessness of Jesus Christ. This was in the midst of my defense there (and elsewhere) of my pastor, John Piper, and his association with Driscoll. The gnat to be strained here was a Driscoll quote from October of 2006:

If you’re tempted to these sorts of things — including sexual sin — some of you say, “Now Mark, Jesus wasn’t sexually tempted.” Well, of course he was — 30 something year old single man who had women who adored him. You don’t think he ever wanted the comfort of a woman? You don’t think he ever got tired of going to bed by himself? You don’t think that he didn’t once want to have intimate relations with a woman? He was tempted.

- Mark Driscoll, How Human Was Jesus?

In typical DefCon, foaming-at-the-mouth, fashion, Desert Pastor (DP) rails against Driscoll and Piper. (Piper is apparently now responsible for everything Driscoll has ever spoken and written.) DefCon also applies the bait-and-switch in order to prop up their diatribes against Driscoll by repeatedly stating he attributed to Christ particular sexual desires for particular women. Of course, Driscoll never said this. Driscoll merely stated that Christ was tempted sexually (Hebrews 4:15 – to be tempted “in every respect” or “at all points” must certainly entail sexual temptation). Christ, being fully man, desired marital intimacy without sinning.

DP goes so far as to shut Driscoll out of heaven for his comments:

It is a mockery to say that such a one who openly (and seemingly) with no remorse and repentance and no chastisement or discipline even has the Spirit of God dwelling within him.

In an addendum to the post, DP writes:

His [Driscoll's] verbage indicates that Jesus wanted/desired what He could not have. He also made it clear that Jesus had an unsatisfied state. This explicitly demeans the sinlessness of Jesus Christ.

This is what I would like to focus on in this post. The above comment and others like it rubbed me wrong when I initially read them, but I had tired of warring against the cranks over at DefCon and did not then pursue it. Recently, however, these comments have come to mind again and I want to explore what I believe to be a serious error in DP’s thinking here, because it is an error many of us might fall into in our zeal to defend the holiness of God and Christ. (And, perhaps, in our unholy zeal for personal rightness; a supposed orthodoxy we might unconsciously set our hope of salvation on instead of Christ.)

Are not weariness, thirst and hunger “unsatisfied states”? Did Jesus never tire? (John 4:6) Was He never hungry or thirsty? (Mark 11:12, John 19:28) Do these wants and unsatisfied states demean the deity or sinlessness of Christ? If no, then why would the want of legitimate marital intimacy demean it?

In comments on Octorber 1, 2008 at 1:38 PM, DP writes:

He [Christ] had no evil, perverted, or sexual desires that were unrealized or unfulfilled and therefore was enticed by the temptation of “wanting” to go to bed with a woman! He did not “WANT” for anything for He was perfect. To assume that the Perfect God in the private of His mind dwelt on the thoughts of having intimate physical relations with a woman is far beyond the pale of Scripture!

First off, Driscoll never ascribes any “evil, perverted or sexual desires” to Christ or that he “dwelt on” such thoughts. This is another glaring example of Team DefCon setting up a brother in Christ and minister of the Word (oh, wait – DP has already anathematized Driscoll, so I guess he’s neither his brother nor a minister) by placing words in their mouths they never spoke or scribed.

Second, Christ didn’t want anything? Ever? According to DP & Co., was Christ truly and fully man?

In comments on Octorber 2, 2008 at 7:58 PM, DP writes:

One more thing, Jesus did NOT ask to be spared the Cross!!!! He did not ask to avoid suffering. To even insinuate, imply, or outright accuse the One Who was the Lamb slain from before the foundations of the world is contrary to Scripture.

Apparently, Mark 14:35-36 has been excised from DP’s Bible. Again, there seems to be an inability or unwillingness here to admit Christ’s human nature.

In comments on Octorber 3, 2008 at 8:49 PM, fellow DefCon haranguer, Coram Deo (CD), writes:

Driscoll’s comments are demonically inspired and blasphemous. Such statements are hell-spawned and spoken by the mouthpieces of Satan himself.

And on October 9, 2008 at 9:20 PM:

I’m sorry [No, CD, you're not]; maybe hearing this sort of filth being spewed forth from behind the pulpit just doesn’t bother some people, but to me in the light of scripture this is an excruciatingly blasphemous and satanic perversion of my Lord and my God which deeply grieves my spirit.

Well, I never have found CD to be one for subtlety. Why the overreaction to Driscoll’s affirmation of Christ’s human nature?

———————-

Apollinaris

Best known, however, as a noted opponent of Arianism, Apollinaris’ eagerness to emphasize the deity of Jesus and the unity of his person led him so far as to deny the existence of a rational human soul (νους) in Christ’s human nature, this being replaced in him by the logos, so that his body was a glorified and spiritualized form of humanity.

Apollinarianism

Apollinarianism was the heresy taught by Apollinaris the Younger, bishop of Laodicea in Syria about 361. He taught that the Logos of God, which became the divine nature of Christ, took the place of the rational human soul of Jesus and that the body of Christ was a glorified form of human nature. In other words, though Jesus was a man, He did not have a human mind but that the mind of Christ was solely divine. Apollinaris taught that the two natures of Christ could not coexist within one person. His solution was to lessen the human nature of Christ.

Apollinarianism was condemned by the Second General Council at Constantinople in 381. This heresy denies the true and complete humanity in the person of Jesus which in turn, can jeopardize the value of the atonement since Jesus is declared to be both God and man to atone. He needed to be God to offer a pure and holy sacrifice of sufficient value and He needed to be a man in order to die for men.

Wanye Grudem, Systematic Theology, P. 534:

The complete absence of sin in the life of Jesus is all the more remarkable because of the severe temptations he faced, not only in the wilderness, but throughout his life. The author of Hebrews affirms that Jesus “in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin” (Heb. 4:15). The fact that he faced temptation means that he had a genuine human nature that could be tempted, for Scripture clearly tells us that “God cannot be tempted with evil” (James 1:13). (Emphasis mine)

Grudem, like Driscoll, clearly affirms that Christ was tempted in every way we are. I wonder if Team DefCon would consider Grudem a “mouthpiece of Satan”?

(A side note: To affirm that Christ was tempted in every respect as we are is not to affirm that Christ must have been tempted with or by every particular sin. For example, it is not necessary to affirm that Christ must have been tempted with homosexual or bestial desires. It simply affirms, in my view, that Christ was tempted in the same categories that we are tempted. To deny that Christ was in any manner tempted sexually is to deny that Christ was tempted in a major category of temptation that every human being has experienced in some form at some level. It would be, in my view, to deny that Christ was fully human and that He can now fully sympathize with our own temptations.)

Team Defcon’s language in rebutting Driscoll smacks to me of Apollinarianism.

Hebrews 4:14-16

Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin. Let us then [therefore] with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

Unless Christ was in every respect tempted as we are; unless Christ is fully man, we cannont with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace. Denying the full manhood of Christ – even if only by implication – is to deny His ability to serve us as High Priest. If Christ is not fully man, He cannot stand in our stead. He cannot save us.

This is a big deal. Bigger, I dare say, than coarse language.

——————-

Lord, grant me a zeal for truth and not a zeal for my own rightness. Forbid my heart from trusting in a supposed spotless orthodoxy, and not in You, the sinless God-Man. Guard my heart and mind from swinging from the errors of one extreme into the errors of another.

17 Responses leave one →
  1. 2008 November 25

    I am very suspicious of statements accusing others of being demonic. Thanks for this post.

  2. 2008 November 26

    Another excellent rebuttal. I have found too often that those who want to focus so much on the deity of Christ do so at the expense of ignoring his humanity. It is the age old attempt of trying to understand what cannot be understood – how Christ can be both fully God and fully man – and is just as wrong as focusing too much on His humanity at the expense of ignoring His deity. Classic Apollinarianism. Thanks for the post.

  3. 2008 November 27

    Desert Pastor has responded – if you can call his pout a response – here:

    http://defendingcontending.com/2008/09/30/mark-driscoll-mocks-the-sinlessness-of-jesus-christ/#comment-7613

    I’ve been banned from DefCon, so I won’t be able to respond there. There’s really no substance here for me to respond to. It would be nice if DP or any of the other DefCon contributors would actually interact with an argument. Instead, they are content to paint their adversaries as cruel heretics and prohibit them from responding.

    Sad…

    DP has here accused me of endorsing heresy and lying. He also expressed his concern with my association with Desiring God and Bethlehem Baptist Church. For the record, I have made all my personal information – including my personal cell phone number and contact information for BBC – available to Team DefCon. I have publicly encouraged them to contact BBC and its elders if they believe I have sinned. As far as I know, this has not happened.

  4. 2008 November 27
    mbaker permalink

    Jim,

    I went over and read the article as well as all the comments. It seems there was only the one commenter there David L., who was keeping the discussion at an issue level. He asked the very same questions I would have asked, but I found the answers given by the moderators somewhat oblique.

    While I’m not a big fan of Mark Driscoll, and agree he goes too far sometimes in his approach, whether Jesus was indeed tempted in every way we are is a fascinating theological subject. I cannot see how the Hebrews scripture could be interpreted by any serious Bible scholar to exclude sexual temptation. If Christ had all the human characteristics that we do as a human, that certainly at some point would have been an issue He had to face and overcome. He hungered and thirsted, so he had to have other necessary desires, and bodily functions common to humans as well. How could He possibly understand all the temptations we face if that were not the case?

    I believe that these folks are again, as they did with Piper’s comments, trying to make a mountain of a molehill. Their personal disapproval, above and beyond the issues stated as the problem, at least to me, comes through loud and clear.

    As you know, I try to remain as objective as possible when it comes to these discussions by trying to stick to the issue itself and and to ferret out all the facts. However, I’m puzzled by the continued venom Defcon seems to harbor against these men as it seems so many of their own answers depart from what they claim the issue was: Driscoll’s departure from orthodoxy in his statement. I could be wrong, but I am left with the impression after reading the Piper critique and now the Driscoll one if there isn’t some deeper issue involved.

    I would invite Desert Pastor, if he is reading here to let’s please have an in-depth theological discussion of the quote itself, and dispense with the personal accusations.

  5. 2008 November 27

    Thanks all for the kind comments! And Happy Thanksgiving!

    Mbaker,

    I would love to have a discussion with any of the DefCon boys, but they’re simply not interested.

    =(

  6. 2008 November 27

    What was interesting is this quote in a follow-up comment: “What is sad is when even family members are willing to jump on the bandwagon in agreement.” That’s me he’s speaking of – I’m DP’s brother. (Up to this point, I have respected his wishes to keep him anonymous in the blog world, but since he has now included our relationship specifically in his comments, I don’t feel the need to do so any longer.) Apparently, it is wrong to disagree with a family member in an open forum. When someone makes such foolhardy and baseless attacks against another brother in Christ in a public forum, I feel it is only right to confront that person in the forum they have selected – whether they are a family member or not. If he considers speaking out against blatant slander, twisting of someone’s words, and clarification of possible heresy/unorthodoxy “jumping on the bandwagon,” so be it, although that is a rather narrow viewpoint of those who disagree with him.

    There was a time when DP would be willing to openly discuss any issue with civility, even if he disagreed. However, ever since his association with the DefCon site, their vitriol, narrow mindedness, and Pharasaical attitude (“it’s my way or the highway” brand of Christianity) has sadly rubbed off on him. Any disagreement is seen as a personal attack and dealt with as such, rather than the issue at hand.

  7. 2008 November 27

    Oh and Happy Thanksgiving!

  8. 2008 November 28

    Stephen (and DP),

    I will be praying for reconciliation and peace between brothers in blood and Christ.

  9. 2008 November 29
    mbaker permalink

    The folks at Defcon were very civil to me when I posted a comment over there. I think there is a bigger issue with them from the reply I received, which is what I suspected at first from the reading the entire thread. The real issue, which is the one they keep coming back to in all their replies, seems to be they personally think Driscoll should either be removed or disciplined, period. I’m not as familiar with his work as Piper’s so I don’t know if the bulk of it is theologically sound or not, and warrants such a claim.

    While I have no axe to grind with the Defcon folks, I wish they had given us more of clue as to why they reacted so violently, being there has been very little theological discussion by them of the rest of Driscoll’s theology they say they do object to. I’ve always been taught if you have a case against someone, it’s best to go at it fact by fact. Since thus far it’s been more of a personal objection to the man and his methods, over one quote which they seem to be so defensive about commenting on, it’s hard for me to determine conclusively where they are really coming from. Until I see more detailed examples of Driscoll’s bad theology proven by comparison to scripture, one has to be left with the impression that it’s based more upon personal disapproval than anything else, and the quote itself, as in Piper’s case, was really the secondary objection.

    Still left scratching my head over the whole thing.

  10. 2008 December 1

    After giving it some thought, I thought I should post a comment retracting my agreement with the charge of Apollinarianism. While the thought process behind DefCon’s denying any sexual temptation of Christ could logically end in Apollinarianism, it does not make that end a necessity. In much the same way, saying that Christ could be sexually tempted could end logically in saying he could have sinned, but that logical conclusion is not necessarily the conclusion we must make. In agreeing with the charge of Apollinarianism, I felt I was just as guilty of using DefCon’s either/or strategy of logical conclusions.

  11. 2008 December 1

    Stephen,

    I wouldn’t necessarily disagree with you. I tried to chose my words carefully in the post above. I said, “Team Defcon’s language in rebutting Driscoll smacks to me of Apollinarianism.”

    smack: to have a taste, flavor, trace, or suggestion: Your politeness smacks of condescension.

    I never said DP or anyone else at DefCon actually claimed Christ was/is not fully human. However, at some point we have to deal with someone who refuses to acknowledge Christ experienced any real temptation. This flatly contradicts Hebrews 4 and effectively denies Christ’s actual humanity. I don’t doubt DP would say, “Yes, I embrace the full humanity of Christ.” However, modalists would say, “Yes, I believe in the Trinity.” They simply simply fill these terms with different meanings.

    I don’t believe, nor did I ever say, DP or anyone else at DefCon is a heretic on the fast-track to hell. (I will leave the unfounded anathematizing to the DefCon cranks.) I was merely pointing out that the flavor of DP’s comments taste of Apollinarianism. I do think there is a real danger here of sliding to far this direction in an attempt to move away from a perceived heresy in Driscoll’s comment.

    Additionally, I really wanted to make the point that everyone’s theology is suspect at some point when inspected microscopically, and that one’s theology can easily veer into error in the very attempt to avoid all error.

    I hope that makes sense.

    God Bless

  12. 2008 December 1

    Jim,

    That makes perfect sense. I think I was posting more for my own clarification than anything else. In essence, I was attempting to make sure I was, as you very well put it, leaving the “unfounded anathematizing to the DefCon cranks.”

  13. 2008 December 1
    mbaker permalink

    I’m just really curious about something, aside from anything regarding Defcon, why is John Piper, who is apparently such a conservative pastor supporting Mark Driscoll? Does he believe Mark Driscoll’s theology is sound, even if his methods are somewhat beyond the norm for the reformed camp?

  14. 2008 December 5

    Hi All,

    I’ve posted regarding the accusations DEFCON makes anonymously…..

    http://phillyflash.wordpress.com/2008/12/05/the-anonymous-finger-pointing-four/

    Phil

  15. 2008 December 27

    Has anyone bothered to point out that being tempted isn’t sin?

    Of course I disagree with Driscoll’s assertion that Jesus got tired of going to bed alone. That smacks of a soulishness that springs from a sin nature, IMO.

    But to jump on the guy as speaking for Satan is just absurd. So what path did satan take to get to DefCon when he left Driscoll? The way they spoke reeks of a demonic type of hatred. Again, this is opinion…but the sick feeling in the gut that I have reading their nonsense seems to speak of a hate that is beyond even our depravity…but, I don’t know.

    They’re just creepy…

    …these guys remind me of Monday morning quarterbacks…full of expert info that is useless to anyone but themselves.

    Thanks for spanking them, they needed it.
    *Jim B may or may not agree with any or all of previously said statements and may take especial offense to the term “spanking”*

    mark jr.

  16. 2008 December 28

    You crack me up, Mark.

  17. 2009 February 11

    Gentlemen

    It is my understanding that an oversimplification of the doctrine of temptation may be problem here..

    Let me explain..

    1) We can be tempted by someone or by a situation that presents itself to us(externaly)

    2) We can also be tempted by our own sinful desires (internally)

    Christ though tempted (externally) never had sinful or illigitimate desires as His mind, will, motives yes even His emotions perfectly conformed to the will of God – so whilst He was tempted at every point (externally) He was without sin!

    Does this not cause us all to love and praise Him more!
    What a Saviour!

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